Mohd Ahsan / Hendra Setiawan

yuquall said:
Weren't you the one who said LYD was the GREATEST MD player for his consistency and title numbers?
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The problem with applying different metrics to justify why your favorite is the best in every debate is that you can't remember them all. Sooner or later you'll contradict yourself.
 
MezzL said:
May I know the reason ?
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If I were to venture a guess, I'd say that Cheung probably watched TG at a time where badminton was more of a focus and a passion than now and his favorite from then will always keep that special place for him....at least that's what I noticed happening to me, new pairs and players just don't excite me quite as much anymore.
Or maybe he just appreciated Tony's grace and versatility on court.
Or maybe I'm utterly wrong on all counts. :D
 
j4ckie said:
If I were to venture a guess, I'd say that Cheung probably watched TG at a time where badminton was more of a focus and a passion than now and his favorite from then will always keep that special place for him....at least that's what I noticed happening to me, new pairs and players just don't excite me quite as much anymore.
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That's understandable. Though in my case, I lost my passion post Candra/Tony era and finally found it back in Kevin :D:D

For Ahsan/Hendra, veterans, to be able to be at the top is cherry on the cake. MD is no longer all about power or stamina. I like it this way. Though ZN to be stuck with hopeless partners (after Fu) is devastating though:(
 
j4ckie said:
If you argue that FHF's partner were better than him, then you cant really talk about individual players in doubles whatsoever. CY didnt achieve anything noteworthy outside of his partnership with FHF, ZN won 1 WC and hasnt done anything at all since then. If they were so much better and FHF was just good, not exceptional, they wouldve succeeded in other partnerships as well. They didnt. It's the same argument that applies to Hendra, really - their continued success in different partnerships is proof they are indeed exceptional players, and didnt just happen to have a much stronger partner or one inexplicably magical partnership. Oh, same goes for Tony Gunawan, btw. Could play well with almost anyone. While that WC title with Bach was something of a fluke, he was very good with both Halim Haryanto and Candra Wijaya (and Bach being a mediocre player wasnt his fault, he still played well in that chapter of his career).



While that is often the case, its not a universal law or rule. The back court player has to set up the front guy as well, if he's a bad player, he wont do that successfully (see Liu/Zhang...). Ask former players what it was like playing vs Fu, they wont tell you "he got carried, mate".

PS: if you watch Fu/Zhang at the 2014 DO or Olympics, or Cai/Fu at the WC or OG tournaments they won, you can hardly argue that Fu was the weaker player. Imop both pairs were very homogenous, not much between players overall (of course each had their individual strengths and weaknesses).
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So who ranks higher, FHF or Hendra? FHF medaled in 3 consecutive OG with 2 golds, while Hendra won B2B AG golds.
 
i think for the last 30 year we can find alot of great players worth to be fondly remembered.some of my favourites players :
Hendra setiawan (4x gold WBC,2xgold AG,2xAE champ,1x Gold OG)
FHF, Park Joo Bong,Ricky/rexy,Tony Gunawan,Ha tae Kwon.
If minions can win Gold OG tokyo i will put them in that bracket too
 
I think Hendra has more (individual) titles than FHF. then comes the longevity and determination part.
 
Yoji said:
I think Hendra has more (individual) titles than FHF. then comes the longevity and determination part.
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HS started winning titles in 2007, didn't do anything at all in 2010, 2011, 2012 until the OG. FHF played from 2004 until 2016 with no real breaks. There's no significant difference between them in terms of longevity. HS right now is exactly where FHF stopped playing if you don't consider him taking a long time off (effectively).
HS won 34, FHF 30 titles total if my count is correct.
 
dont forget that Hendra didnt play in the 2012 OG, if he had, the results may have been different, considering he defeated FHF in 2008.
 
ericksakti said:
dont forget that Hendra didnt play in the 2012 OG, if he had, the results may have been different, considering he defeated FHF in 2008.
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With who? :)

I agree that one's luck in getting the right partner also plays a great deal in one's achievement, however not everyone can make use of it to the optimal. FHF didn't mess up his role in the partnerships he was in though I suspect his form when he partnered ZN had declined considerably. I remember reading an article where CY said about FHF during OG 2012 was in pain all the time, and he couldn't even sleep without taking pain killers every night.

Hendra didn't have that luck between his 2008 OG partnership and his new partnership with Ahsan.
 
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Hbmao said:
So who ranks higher, FHF or Hendra? FHF medaled in 3 consecutive OG with 2 golds, while Hendra won B2B AG golds.
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I think it's a very subjective topic as there isn't much between them anymore. For me, the additional OG silver and gold weigh heavily enough to give Fu the nudge, although I can definitely see why someone else might have different criteria and would give HS the nod. Also, Fu is one of my favorite players of all time, so I find it hard to even attempt to ignore my personal bias.
Let's say it's not as unquestionable (from an objective stand point) as calling LD the GOAT (and even there, you'll find people who come up with some weird reasoning to somehow deny that) :D
 
j4ckie said:
I think it's a very subjective topic as there isn't much between them anymore. For me, the additional OG silver and gold weigh heavily enough to give Fu the nudge, although I can definitely see why someone else might have different criteria and would give HS the nod. Also, Fu is one of my favorite players of all time, so I find it hard to even attempt to ignore my personal bias.
Let's say it's not as unquestionable (from an objective stand point) as calling LD the GOAT (and even there, you'll find people who come up with some weird reasoning to somehow deny that) :D
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I think for now they are about the same level or FHF may have a slight edge, however, if Hendra win the OG next year, I think it can be agreed on that Hendra is the GOAT
 
ericksakti said:
dont forget that Hendra didnt play in the 2012 OG, if he had, the results may have been different, considering he defeated FHF in 2008.
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Weird reasoning, might just as well say that Fu could've won the 2008 final considering he had beaten Hendra before. Especially weird since HS couldn't even qualify for the tournament you're suggesting he might have won...
 
ericksakti said:
I think for now they are about the same level or FHF may have a slight edge, however, if Hendra win the OG next year, I think it can be agreed on that Hendra is the GOAT
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Though there is another point : Fu had always succeeded in most all his Olympics campaign to the 3 finals. While Hendra failed once.
 
yuquall said:
Though there is another point : Fu had always succeeded in most all his Olympics campaign to the 3 finals. While Hendra failed once.
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But fu had always failed in all of his asian games campaign, can't even get a medal there, while hendra have 2 golds.
 
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