Wang Wen

Discussion in 'China Professional Players' started by Elixau, Oct 13, 2007.

  1. Abhorsen

    Abhorsen Regular Member

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    He mainly gets us to practice the movements on a court and hit the bird like in a normal drill but sometimes he gets us to jump on the spot doing variations of where we place each foot such as right in front left in back then reverse. I'm not sure about how to explain them but suffice to say they involve a lot of jumping.
     
  2. Elixau

    Elixau Regular Member

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    Abhorsen, do you know how old Wang Wen is?
     
  3. Abhorsen

    Abhorsen Regular Member

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    I haven't the faintest idea, besides you could probably judge yourself as you've already met and trained under him.
     
  4. stationb

    stationb New Member

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    Don't know how good he is technically, I assume he is probably good. I have seen him at tournaments, he is very hard on the kids when they lose. As a result, a lot of his kids cheat! My children have experienced it first hand. Personally, I think kids participate in the sport to learn sportsmanship and to build character not to learn to cheat. Too much emphasis on winning is very damaging to the junior players.
     
  5. LazyBuddy

    LazyBuddy Regular Member

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    First, I do not know anyone in your region. So, I am not on either side.

    However, judge from the fact you provided, I think it's a bit unfair for Wang Wen, unless your guys caught him on the spot to teach his students "win at all cost". Being a strict teacher and being competitive is nothing wrong, and it's not directly on conflict with "sportsmanship".

    I assume the badminton coach only have minor influence on a kid, when compare to the kids' parents, regular school teacher, and even many other family friends. How many hours the coach being with the kid? I assume no more than 5-10 hrs per week? That's no even comparable to the parent and school teach for a day. Therefore, why single handed blame the coach for the kid's cheating action? How you know the kid doing so, not because say, they have the "hockey dad" kinda parent? :rolleyes:

    When I face a player (junior or adult) who's cheating in a game, I do not think I will blame his whole family, his entire team, his coach, his club manager, his gf, etc. If a person is old enough to enter an open tournament, s/he should be the one taking full (or at least majority) responsibility for his/her own action. The ppl around him/her should be only considered as minor role. :cool:
     
  6. egibney

    egibney Regular Member

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    That is the most bogus thing I have ever heard. I trained with Wang from when I was 8 until I was 19, and even now occasionally take lessons from him at 26. NEVER have I been lead to believe that cheating was in any way an acceptable way to behave. It is easy for you to come on a forum like this where you are completely anonymous and slander his character, how about telling people who you are so you can be held accountable?

    I can't articulate how angry I am at your completely ignorant comment towards someone who has shaped the characters of countless kids over the years, and the Glenora does not have a reputation for producing cheaters simply because your child had an experience where they thought they were being cheated.

    As for Wang's technically abilities as a player and a coach, grade A, top notch. He was on the Chinese national team but didn't get a chance to play internationally for them after juniors so he moved to Canada for more opportunity and an education. He won junior nationals in China as well. Not to mention he has immense character.
     
  7. stationb

    stationb New Member

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    I apologize if my post regarding Mr. W. came across the wrong way. I was in no way implying that he tells his kids to cheat! I was referring to the fact that sometimes kids on the junior circuit experience too much pressure and some of them will resort to cheating. This happens with kids from all different clubs, not just one or two in particular. I totally agree with LazyBuddy and his take on the issue.
     
  8. cooler

    cooler Regular Member

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    if kids don't learn about pressure at tournaments, when and where do they learn it from? Remember, WW get pressure from parents for their kids not performing. If the club and parents don't care, everybody can be a coach.
     
  9. stationb

    stationb New Member

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    Everyone knows that as we all face pressure as we grow older. Having played sports competitively for so many years one of the biggest lessons that I have learned from playing sports is learning how to deal with pressure and over coming challenges that you face on the court. Learning how to deal with pressure and challenges was not only beneficial in competing in sports but the greatest benefit was taking these leassons and applying it to life especially for my career ( which has now allowed me to live very comfortably ). As we all know, very very few people will become a professional sports player who earns millions of dollars so as parents we need to encourage our kids that to win or to become good in sports they must learn to adapt to pressure, learn from challenges and change to meet these challenges, but most of all they must learn to do this with integrity, humility and respect. The total goal of sports as I feel is to learn life lessons that will apply to your future. If my children learn this from playing sports and apply it to their future goals and career then I feel my children will have gained more than just medals but life lessons as well. The sad thing is sometimes parents, players and coaches lose sight of this and the people who pay the price for this the most is the kids. Sports and education must go hand in hand to ensure that our children's future is our ultimate focus.
     
  10. cooler

    cooler Regular Member

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    those are great values and principles to go by but how many parents practise them? It is your (parents) job to instill value to YOUR kids. Too many parents want their coach/teacher to do their work. Just look at hockey, where kids, coaches and game officials get abused from the parents. Most coaches respond to what the parents wanted. I know royal glenora is a reputable club, i doubt WW would resort to immoral tactic and value even if he is under pressure from parents. If he is bad with kids, WW would be long gone i tell u.

    http://www.naso.org/sportsmanship/badsports.html
     
  11. stationb

    stationb New Member

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    I agree with parents being involved but part of the picture that many of us fail to see is that coaches spend a lot of time with our kids just like their teachers in school. We would be foolish to believe that the coaches and teachers do not influence our children, the truth is that our children are influenced by all the people around them. It is true that you say that many parents want their coaches and teachers to do all the work for the parents but then you wonder why these parents think this way. Could it be social up bringing, unrealistic expectations, perfectionism, or lack of support from others around (extended family members and friends).Good coaches will always do what is best for the children because coaches are suppose to teach skills and sportmanship and should these coaches ever lose these values because parents pressure them then the coach should really evaluate himself or herself. As for why someone stays, I am not to judge this because I am not in that person's shoes nor do I know what expectations are laid out by those around him. I am not here to put anyone down but you can see in the news where amateur sports are becoming more confrontational and more and more parents are worried if putting children into sports is a right decision. Let's all hope that parents, coaches and children all get back to the basics of what amateur sports is all about and that is having fun and learning life lessons.
     
  12. t3tsubo

    t3tsubo Regular Member

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    funny, i am a junior player playing under wang's coaching in his elite A group and i find everyone is honest to the point of "i saw the shuttle land just out but they werent sure so they'll give the point to me".
    judging by the fact that you revived a semi old thread, are you talking about a recent experience at the derrick junior tournament last weekend? or at the glenora junior tournament the same weekend?
     
  13. cooler

    cooler Regular Member

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    u r asking too much in today's society. Those old values are great but today's coach has to look after many many students, he/she can't give special attention to everyone of them, he'll be exhausted. Sure u will hear a few good stories in the news but those are exception and not the norm. Unless u ask and pay your dues to WW to be your son/daughter lifetime sifu, no coach would go beyond than lessons as per class program. The ultimate responsibility falls on parents hand, make no bones about it. U asked why so many today parents are delegating their parenting job? it's called shedding one's responsibility and accountibility. Damn they paid their taxes and it is the gov't to fix things, I paid for the lesson and i want my kid to be a perfect sportman. This topic is very important but it goes much much deeper than most people can comprehend on top of their daily rut. Can people comprehend the thought of one world governement or would they rather worry about what to wear on the outing tonight? It's good u ask these questions but the best person to teach one's kids are their parents. The is my final answer.
     
    #73 cooler, Mar 2, 2009
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2009
  14. bdiddy

    bdiddy New Member

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    What a back-track this was. You were implying that Wang Wen's pupils cheated and that you have experienced it first hand. Just admit that you have absolutely no clue what youa re talking about!
     
  15. LazyBuddy

    LazyBuddy Regular Member

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    Please re-read your previous post, you clearly pointed out "learn to cheat". I just can not see why you say, "no way implying"... :(

    Anyway, today's society is all about "pointing finger":

    Kids fail in school - teacher's fault
    racket broke - stringer's fault
    get into an accident - the other driver's fault
    lost a match - opponent's fault...

    Well, if everyone is really "that perfect" (because it's always others are bad), then I wonder how come we do not have a perfect world yet...
     
  16. YY8300

    YY8300 Regular Member

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    I agree with you, there is a lot of pressure coach under Wang. Although I haven't seen Coach Wang's students cheated but I believe it's possible. There was one incident happened in Royal Glenora Junior 2008, the first U12 mixed doubles match of Wang's son was supposed to play against a stronger team from the same club, Wang didn't want his son lost in first round, so he changed the draw, moved the stronger team away from his son's team. This was a 100% true, my friend's kid was playing the same tourney, he still has the original draw set up by Badminton Alberta and the draw that manipulated by Wang. I guess it was the tourney held in his club, he thought he has the powder to change it according to his will.
     
  17. egibney

    egibney Regular Member

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    The fact that a draw was changed from the original does not prove your point. You have no idea what the circumstances behind this situation were, and you do not provide proof. You're bashing someone on a forum that you do not know and obviously have nothing but speculation and rumour to go off of.

    I've known Wang for almost 20 years. He was my coach. So of course my perspective is biased in his favour. However, I think it is completely immature and disrespectful to engage in this kind of talk without providing facts and without real insight into the situation.

    The attitude that Wang instilled in us when I was playing was that you can never avoid the better players. If you want to win, and you want that win to be considered legitimate you have to beat all of the best players. Dodging a better player would not help his son and I don't see him doing that anyway.

    One thing I can say is that this sort of behaviour (bad mouthing coaches, other players) is something that has gone on for a long time in badminton, and I have no doubt it is very much present in other sports as well. What always irritates me is seeing the parents engaging in it, and therefore teaching their kids these terrible habits. Show some character.

    My name is Emmet Gibney, private message me on here and I'd be happy to get in touch with you via phone, email or whatever method you prefer and we can discuss this like adults.

    By the way, in tournaments there are often rules in place when making a draw where players from the same club, or sometimes same province (depends on the tournament jurisdiction) are NOT supposed to play each other first round, or sometimes even be on the same side of the draw. Understand the sport before you chime in.
     
  18. YY8300

    YY8300 Regular Member

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    http://www.tournamentsoftware.com/sport/draw.aspx?id=4E0FD7DE-D2CE-4A0C-9F02-EC449DC97C2C&draw=3

    Here is the draw, Wang switched team #8 and #11, if he didn't do that, his son would have lost to the event winners in the first round and wouldn't got into final.
    I know there are some rules in badminton draw, but the draw set up by badminton Alberta usually check that already. You should know it's hard to avoid the players from the same club to play in the first round, there are less and less players nowadays, and there are only 4 clubs in alberta. If you want to know why he changed it, you better ask Wang and let me know.
     
  19. egibney

    egibney Regular Member

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    Ty Lindeman is from the same club, same city, and is doubles partners with Wang's son. Generally you do not schedule players against someone from their own club in the first round. I can assure you that Jeff Bell the head of Badminton Alberta would have been consulted before the draw was changed. All draws HAVE to be approved by Badminton Alberta if the event is sanctioned by Badminton Alberta.
     
  20. t3tsubo

    t3tsubo Regular Member

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    There are more than 4 clubs in alberta (edison, red willow, etc in addition to the 4 big ones), and I think it's understandable that he could ask for a switch. Plus, it is not know whether the draw by Badminton alberta had made an honest mistake in pairing 2 glenora teams against each other in the same round. Normally if it is possible for no team kills in the opening round then the draw is set up such that there is none.

    And as emmet said, this is not an issue to take up with Wang but to take up with Jeff Bell
     

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