Thanks for visiting us!

Badminton Central is a free community for fans of badminton! If you find anything useful here please consider registering to see more content and get involved with our great community users, it takes less than 15 seconds! Everybody is welcome here.

Click here for a FREE account!

MK/HS: Bright future ahead?

Discussion in 'Indonesia Professional Players' started by ye333, Sep 29, 2008.

  1. narnia

    narnia Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2007
    Messages:
    1,437
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    DKF
    badMania pointed very well. :)

    JJS will join the badminton team inside the military next year but expected to keep partnership with LYD when they play in international games representing for KOR. So MK/HS should keep caring about that.
    IMO, the motive MK/HS could win the Gold in Beijing was that they lost to JJS/LYD two times in a row this year as you mentioned. They must have practiced very hard to win the only team they had fear.

    Especially, this year JJS/LYD had mastered the playing styles of INA, MAS, and CHN so that they could win over them with confidence. However their only fear was against the european style as MK/HS also had the same difficulties with LP/JR. And Beijing was their first participation of the Olympics and they were too concerned about their first opponent and chinese unfair judges. IMO, if they could manage the pressure in the first round, they surely had confidence to win MK/HS in final (on the contrary, MK/HS would have fear).

    BTW, JJS/LYD will participate in the Shanghai super series in November, but unfortunately INA won't.
     
    #41 narnia, Oct 28, 2008
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2008
  2. badMania

    badMania Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2005
    Messages:
    18,591
    Likes Received:
    73
    Location:
    Hong Kong
    They have beaten Lars Paaske/Jonas Rasmussen twice this year (including the Beijing Olympics SF match), who themselves have beaten Jung Jae Sung/Lee Yong Dae TWICE this year also. The fact that Jung/Lee lost as early as the first round in Beijing is an indication that they are probably not as strong as what most people have predicted prior to the Beijing Games. So, I don't think Kido/Hendra FEAR Jung/Lee. Remember, Kido/Hendra also triumphed over Jung/Lee in the Final of World Championships 2007 ;)

    The opponents Kido/Hendra beat in the Beijing Games included 2 ex World Champions and 1 ex All-England and Asian Games Individual Gold Medallist. I think they DESERVE the Gold Medal after surviving a difficult draw prior to the Final.
     
  3. narnia

    narnia Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2007
    Messages:
    1,437
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    DKF
    Not convincing. MK/HS has also been defeated by LP/JR last year, then you will conclude LP/JR are the best? In the sports like badminton, there exist this kind of relations: beating and beated. And the speed from the rallypoint system has brought much changes in the strategies and movements. MK/HS should have fear especially against JJS/LYD becuase they lost "completely" in the last two important games. Please check the videos how much they were embarrassed not finding their positions in the court. You can read it from their faces. On the contrary, JJS/LYD was full of confidence in their movements. Especially Kido's moves are easily read. That surely made MK/HS get motivated to train even harder.
    And as for LYD, he's just 20 and had been improved a lot partnering with JJS for the last two years. He's not a big smasher nor a rocket-speed player. Instead, he's a fast learner, best frontman, best in reading his opponents' movements. Now, he's just mastered all the movements of his major opponents and can exactly anticipate their next moves and lead them make faults. Just watch his videos. The Beijing was only due to the Olympic pressure as everybody knows(he's too young and it's their first participation).
     
    #43 narnia, Oct 28, 2008
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2008
  4. narnia

    narnia Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2007
    Messages:
    1,437
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    DKF
    And... don't forget LYD won over two INA teams in XD SF and F: Limpele and Widianto. How? With XD ranking of just 10th? Because he knows very well about INA's playing style. But it was a tragedy it happened just after he was awaken from the first game pressure with JJS.
     
  5. george@chongwei

    george@chongwei Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2007
    Messages:
    30,013
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    MIA
    seems that u are a big fan of lee yong dae:):D
     
  6. abedeng

    abedeng Regular Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2004
    Messages:
    18,692
    Likes Received:
    115
    Occupation:
    Occupying Tall Buildings
    Location:
    In Competition
    Calm down, narnia. LYD has the potential to be a great player and possibly eclipse his countryman, Park Joo Bong. Having won All-England MD and Olympic XD at such a young age, he is one of the best players in the circuit right now. But so are the INA pair.

    About who is better than the rest, well that's subjective and based on what we see. As they are all young, improvements will continue. But it is normal to see how some pairs have more difficulty against one particular playing style compared to other pairs.
     
  7. badMania

    badMania Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2005
    Messages:
    18,591
    Likes Received:
    73
    Location:
    Hong Kong
     
    #47 badMania, Oct 28, 2008
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2008
  8. badMania

    badMania Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2005
    Messages:
    18,591
    Likes Received:
    73
    Location:
    Hong Kong
    Exactly...wise words from abedeng (as always). No one is doubting Lee Yong Dae's brilliance. But to completely discredit the INA pair's achievement in the Beijing Olympics as unconvincing is just a tad too much :cool:
     
    #48 badMania, Oct 28, 2008
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2008
  9. badMania

    badMania Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2005
    Messages:
    18,591
    Likes Received:
    73
    Location:
    Hong Kong
    So did Kido/Hendra in their first Olympics, facing the Chinese 2nd pair in front of the home crowd, with the huge burden on their shoulder of winning the Olympics Gold, they nearly crumbled too. Luckily, their experience brought them through and they were able to defeat Guo Zhendong/Xie Zhongbo in rubber-set.

    There's no way Kido/Hendra were to face Jung/Lee in the Final because they would have met earlier in the SF :cool: And, if the results stayed the same....Kido/Hendra had beaten Koo/Tan prior to facing Jung/Lee, they would have gotten such a morale booster in beating their MAS nemesis and would go into the match against the KOR pair full of confidence that they can overcome all odds, not full of fear ;)
     
  10. badadum

    badadum Regular Member

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2008
    Messages:
    2,313
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    USA
    One of the rare occasion badMania get worked up :)

    Head to Head, they're even at 3-3, so I think this paragraph summed it up nicely:
     
  11. ye333

    ye333 Regular Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2004
    Messages:
    2,613
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    US
    If by "best form" you mean current best form, then I don't think Koo/Tan is a problem. Also, for "team-mates", Gill Clark indeed mentioned that MK/HS didn't seem concentrated when they lost to their teammates.

    LP/JR is getting old and cannot keep their speed throughout the whole match, otherwise I don't think they would lose to FHF/SY.

    You see, the situation is that, except for Jung/Lee, all other pairs have to be "in their best" to challenge a normal MK/HS. What happens when MK/HS is in "their best"? Who can stop them? I would say only Jung/Lee.

    The past DO final clearly shows that SY/FHF just cannot keep up with MK/HS and were sent into every corner of the court.

    The only concern for MK/HS is their consistency (throughout the season and throughout a match). But they seem to be improving on this during the past year.

     
  12. badMania

    badMania Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2005
    Messages:
    18,591
    Likes Received:
    73
    Location:
    Hong Kong
    I agree that a re-match between Kido/Hendra and Jung/Lee will be worth a watch ;) What I don't agree is that it's implied that even if Kido/Hendra is at their best, they will still be unable to match Jung/Lee (as suggested by our LYD fan here). What's more interesting is that the KOR pair has already mastered the techniques to beat all INA, MAS, and CHN pairs; only to lose out to the aging Danes. How ironic that is.....

    Again, I don't disagree with your last point on consistency. It does seem to me that the INA pair will only find their best form after the mid-year (in 2005-2008 at least). So far, I can only recall them winning 1 title before June, that's the MAS SS 2008. ALL the titles they had won were tournaments held after June :eek:

    As for consistency during the match...I guess it affects all pairs, including the KOR pair. You also commented that if Koo/Tan and Kido/Hendra were to have 1.5 solid games against the KOR pair, they would have won the matches in the BAC and Swiss Open Finals this year, given their dominance in the first-set ;)
     
  13. ye333

    ye333 Regular Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2004
    Messages:
    2,613
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    US
    I would say that Chinese MDs are best in the consistency throughout a match. I guess that's because of their style. After them are the Korean pairs.

     
  14. narnia

    narnia Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2007
    Messages:
    1,437
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    DKF
    This tells the status quo. Some guy like badMania likes to live in the past reflecting the games in the past. (Don't say about the games after Olympic, which were of mainly minor players or splitted teams.) Among 3-3, anybody knows the recent games care much more in this rapidly changing world of badminton: 2 games this year won by KOR, which tells the true story. I'm just talking about head-to-head between THE TWO TEAMS. :D Anyone can list up all their winning games against blah blah teams... Just compare the two teams to each other.

    FYI, just check out the scoring data of those recent two games if you want to know how strong the KOR team was against INA. INA just got tired out after winning a single set after much efforts. That was their limitation. :)
     
    #54 narnia, Oct 28, 2008
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2008
  15. narnia

    narnia Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2007
    Messages:
    1,437
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    DKF
    I agree with you.

    Especially, Kido is a fault-factory, who is a good target for their opponents. He makes many unforced errors mainly he's trying to approach to the net. HS is more consistent. So, the game's winning usually depends on how much Kido is in good form on that day. That fact is completely known to KOR. Please watch the videos. I watched them tens of times in both perspectives. By 2007, LYD was 18-19 yrs old under learning. JJS was inconsistent in his defense and net play like Kido but this year his front skills were tremendously improved to prove their strength as all of you watch it through the series of the games. :)
     
  16. badadum

    badadum Regular Member

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2008
    Messages:
    2,313
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    USA
    And for all their improvement, what happened to them during OG? Crash and burn in the 1st round to the aging Danes pair. I guess they just doesn't know how to play the Danes despite all the videos and analyst available to them (especially after the TC loss).

    Talk is cheap, but at the end of the day, the korean pair failed miserably at the grandest event in Badminton. That's the fact. :p
     
    #56 badadum, Oct 28, 2008
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2008
  17. badadum

    badadum Regular Member

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2008
    Messages:
    2,313
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    USA
    Reflecting games in the past?? We're talking about the OG here, where JJS/LYD can't even advance from the 1st round. That's hardly 2 months ago! Its not MK/HS fault that JJS/LYD need longer time to recuperate and just play within the confine of their nation.

    Besides, with JJS joining the army and getting older, do you really think he can continue keeping up with the so-called ever changing pace of the badminton world?
     
  18. badMania

    badMania Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2005
    Messages:
    18,591
    Likes Received:
    73
    Location:
    Hong Kong
    In that case...how would you comment on Fu/Cai's collapse in the Olympic Games Final, after such a dominant first set? That's one indication of consistency as well, if I read you correctly.

    Consistency throughout a match will require maintaining full consistency, which will be hard even for the best pair to do. Even Tony/Candra and Candra/Sigit at their best can't claim that they can maintain their consistency throughout a match. esp when facing fellow top pairs.
     
  19. badMania

    badMania Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2005
    Messages:
    18,591
    Likes Received:
    73
    Location:
    Hong Kong
    You should read the Chinese's fans comments about Jung Jae Sung in particular (if you can understand Chinese of course ;)).

    There's always a weak link in every partnership and I believe our INA coaches also know what's the weakness in the KOR pair :rolleyes:

    Unfortunately, despite the superb and outstanding skills that Lee Yong Dae and Jung Jae Sung possess, you still can't deny the fact that they lost to an over-aged Danish pair in the first round of Olympics, who recently lost to a scratch pairing of Fu Haifeng/Shen Ye. This is something that of course did not happen to our "weak" INA pair. Well said indeed.
     
  20. badMania

    badMania Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2005
    Messages:
    18,591
    Likes Received:
    73
    Location:
    Hong Kong
    .....well said....and the limitation of the KOR pair is that they were not able to overcome a veteran Danish pair...losing in straight-sets :eek: So a mental collapse? Unable to bear the burden? That's something that Kido/Hendra unfortunately did prove at Beijing.....no mental collapse, just business done.
     

Share This Page