@Gollum, see these pictures, of the 11:48 which you think is the most directly above, in the sense of being, not outside the shoulder.. So picking the examples that you think makes your point best. I don't know how you can say it's not outside the shoulder. By what definition of outside the shoulder can you say it's not outside the shoulder? Whether you are comparing it with 2 lines perpendicular to the floor, or whether you are taking into account shoulder tilt, it seems to me to be outside the shoulder. These lines going through the middle of the shoulder and the middle of the hand, show that. http://i.imgur.com/IprFqJd.png
^ Don't get caught up with all these unnecessary details. There's an absolute optimal way, an absolute wrong way, and a whole bunch of gray zones in between. It's not possible to be in the perfectly optimal position to hit perfectly correctly every single time. As long as you use pronation, grip tightening, relaxed reach and the contact point is somewhere 1-2 ft in front of you within the 11 to 2 o'clock window for a right hander, then you'll be fine.
Well, I think we do agree that the wording in the manual is ambiguous. All I can say is that when we use anatomical definitions, the word to use is lateral - lateral to the midline. As you correctly point out the midline changes on the overhead shot. I believe that coaching manual is written for Level One in England. Many participants may not necessarily have a high technical level. BTW, I have done peer review for journals, written and reviewed research proposals in the past. So my English should just about be OK-ish.
Pah, if you're not the editor of the Oxford Dictionary himself, or maybe the Queen, I'm afraid your English doesn't check out on this forum As with most coaching materials, they shouldn't be taken as gospel. Although biomechanics can give you the 'best' technique from a leverage/power perspective, there are many examples of pro sportsmen who have unconventional techniques and are probably even better known because of them. I reckon at some point in the past, even playing left handed would have been seen as a massive disadvantage... Difference is the coaching materials give a platform to teach those who know nothing better.
The hand is not directly below the contact point. There is an angle between the racket and the forearm -- that is, the racket shaft is not in line with the forearm. Without this angle, forearm pronation cannot be used effectively. You cannot see this in those freeze-frames, because the racket is a blur.
So just to clarify what you're saying..so i'm understanding you exactly correctly, would you agree with A and B? A)The professional in the video has an incorrect grip i.e. in this case, the racket is not correctly positioned in their hand? B)The racket head as shown at 11:48 , looking at the middle picture, the purple line is going through the middle of the racket head? And either way, C)How can you know that when the racket head is a blurr / when you can't really see the racket or shuttlecock in the video?
Strongly disagree. Agree, that is roughly where the racket head will be. It's certainly closer than the other line. Because as a coach, I understand the biomechanics involved and I have watched a great deal of professional play. I suggest you watch some slow-motion smashes. You will see that there is always an angle between the forearm and racket. Always.
@Cheung Great observation there. On that note, to clarify, striking the shuttle laterally or from the posterior is poor, while the optimal striking point is slightly ahead? @ralphz Lateral simply refers to a horizontal orientation. Inside and outside however, can be ambiguous terms; most of us would interpret inside/outside as either interior/exterior or use it relative to some reference. Inside and Outside makes no sense without a proper definition of its reference plane.
Let's say one was to measure the lateral distance between the hand and the shoulder. Which do you think is the correct way that one would consider lateral distance when the torso is bent sideways, would you say it's measured like the the middle pic(lines perpendicular to the floor), or measured like the pic on the far right(midline parallel with torso)? (though I guess even in the middle pic the midline is parallel with the torso but we just don't measure from it and we don't even measure from a line parallel to it) What would interior/exterior mean? (i've heard of internal and external, but not really interior/exterior)
OK so you've shown in that clip you provided, that there's an angle between forearm and racket and should always be. So granted the racket head or the middle of the racket head will not be on the brown line(in line with the hand). Purple line would be in line with the shoulder. It wasn't clear to me, when you said the purple line roughly where the racket would be.. Did you mean that if you were to place a mark or line then you'd put it near that purple line but not exactly where that purple line is? If you were to specify a different line then i'll aid that a little.. I've drawn in 10 dots going left to right, between the brown and purple lines. Approximately where would the contact point be? (e.g. which dot counting from the left, dot 1/10? dot 2/10? e.t.c.) I should probably have included more dots in case you say that it might potentially be slightly medial to the shoulder! I've drawn an arrow pointing to the dots. And i'd be interested if you think for example, an optimal point is slightly lateral to the purple line.. And would be interesting to hear reasons for the position. Thanks http://i.imgur.com/4BZF4X4.png
Can I ask how this is actually helping anyone play better badminton? I've always thought of myself as a "details coach", but this is too much even for me. I've already said that the optimal contact point is approximately above the racket shoulder. I don't see why that is hard to understand; or is this more about wanting to argue? Trying to pin it down to an exact measurement isn't going to help anyone. Everyone hits a bit differently anyway, even at the world-class level. And for all players, technique must be trained in a manner that adapts to the rally situation.
Just trying to understand. Not trying to argue. So if it's slightly lateral or slightly medial to the shoulder it doesn't matter? There is a guy at my club that hits a good smash at a position that, in the lateral/medial axis, is between his eyes. I guess you could say that is within a range that is approximately above his racket shoulder. He will try to get that position. Would you say that could be good technique too?
If we're talking about a small deviation either side, I wouldn't worry about it. With that said, if I were coaching a player who consistently did this -- and enough so that I could easily spot it -- then I might suggest they try adjusting it. But I wouldn't be too forcible about telling them what to do. If the overall technique looks sound, and if they are hitting well, then I'm not going to worry too much about small personal quirks in the way they hit. To me, that sounds like it's not ideal. Perhaps he could hit better if he changed the contact point. But then again, it sounds like he's doing okay with his current technique. One issue with his technique is that it sounds like he might struggle in his forehand corner, whenever he is forced to play in less-than-ideal positions. This issue becomes especially noticeable in singles. It would also depend how he's achieving that contact point. If he is just reaching across with the shoulder, rather than leaning the body, then I might be concerned about the potential for injury. Technique quality is a spectrum. At one end you have obvious and drastic errors; at the other, you have subtle issues that can be hard to distinguish from personal style. I feel as a coach it's important not to become too arrogant when you are tempted to "correct" the latter. If seen through the lens of world-class performance, almost nobody has good technique in any aspect of their game.
Hey M Seeley would you be able to check my technique? Ive been experiencing shoulder pain for the last 2 years. I think it's an error in my technique. I want to win provincials but this has become a big issue with my collar bone starting to pop out. If you could help that would be much appreciated. I'll can pay you if needed. Please help I really want to get back to playing at my best again
