Chinese Badminton

I see that the Chinese team lacks heart.

The Japan and Korea players seem to enjoy the game, love the competition. They enjoy every moment.

The Chinese players don't seem to be enjoying themselves. When they lose, they seem sad. When they win, they seem relieved, not happy. During the match, it seems their mentality is "I wish the match was over already". They dont enjoy the game, they just want to have the win.

That's what sets Chen Long apart. Unlike the other players, he enjoys the game. He looks forward to the challenge.
 
visor said:
In XD, Lu Kai who's incredibly attacking with higher shots above the tape, however is surprisingly weak when he has to return any shots below tape or close to his tall body. Even Steen commented on this early during the match.
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the most insightful comment steen made during the xd match was about over celebrating every point won and whining about every point lost & mistake made (he was talking about team china). you are creating an emotional roller coaster in your own head making it harder to focus on the overall game plan.

this notion is lost on today's young players.
 
samkool said:
the most insightful comment steen made during the xd match was about over celebrating every point won and whining about every point lost & mistake made (he was talking about team china). you are creating an emotional roller coaster in your own head making it harder to focus on the overall game plan.

this notion is lost on today's young players.
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Yes, I thought it was quite a revelation when he mentioned that you can't judge how you're doing from just one rally or one point, because of the emotional roller coaster as you said. He mentioned that instead we should be framing a few rallies or points in order to judge how we're doing on court.

And of course, never over celebrate too early. Best example of this is Chen QingChen in her SF match against JPN and then in her WD match against KOR.

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Chen Qingchen and Akane Yamaguchi are two very different personalities. CQC is irrepressible on court, Akane reserved and self-possessed - they can't help being the way they are and may change somewhat or considerably as they mature and age. Usually , one's personality is hard to change, but character, yes.

CQC's on-court reactions also depend on the occasion and the opponent; in ordinary tournaments, Chen Qingchen is often less expressive, even in the final match. Bu when she plays a formidable opponent, the more so on the big occasions such as the major championships, she simply can't repress her emotions, jumping for joy like a child when winning, showing frustration and annoyance with herself when things are not going her way, esp on her own mistakes. Akane, on the other hand, is quite even-tempered throughout, irrespective of the occasion.

Of course, I understand CQC's behaviour can irritate some people, say her opponents (whom I should say is too engrossed in the match to bother) and those rooting for her opponents. But, in my opinion, CQC's on-court celebrations on winning a point and at the end of the match won, is within my acceptable limit, not overboard, and that's because she is being true to herself, all confine within her side of the court, not directed at her opponent such as glaring, screaming, or fist-pumping at the opponent, and that's why it's not against the BWF rules.

I guess when we like or support a particular player, we tend to accept him or her wholesale, warts and all, still we should do so within reasonable limits which, however, are based on our own perceptions and value system. Frankly, compared with other sports, badminton is relatively mild in most regards, only rarely do we find instances of gross violations. Let's give and take,except when it's really too much, in that case I'm sure BWF will step in.
 
Xia Xuanze is taking his job, previously as CHN MS chief coach and now as the entire singles head coach, very seriously, perhaps too seriously and overly involved.

It's reported, in the lead up to the Rio Oylmpics he lost weight by 3 kg due to elevated stress and anxiety over the CHN MS. And for the Sudirman Cup he again lost another 5 kg, so much so that he joked even his tummy is gone.

Read from here http://sports.qq.com/a/20170529/015993.htm
 
I wanna add a bit on Akane Yamaguchi's court expression since I was dealing with Japanese closely for extended period in the past. Culture-wise, the Japanese people practically avoid showing their true feeling, emotions publicly, they're accustomed to that public image. Only within the closer, extended interactions in smaller circle, they may be showing the truer feeling, the closer to the real expressions.

Foreigners those will see the Japanese people as very polite, very well behaved, much self-refrain. Only on closer interactions and for longer time folks may see the more real characters of Japanese people. If any deviation of this generally true appearance, they are of small minority. Just pay attention on all the Japanese players on court, all tend to be quite reserved, mild expressions!

On the other things, about the WS, both SY and HBJ seem to be conclusively a waste at the top level competitions, in particular the former I seem to have no doubt in my judgement! HBJ may still have a chance IF and ONLY IF she can reduce her weight, up much her fitness then agility, lack of these, she's just hopeless at the top level competition.

After being beaten in Thomas Cup last year and now Sudirman Cup, I just hope all the failures will serve as a big bombshell for the rude awakening of the CBA. Now with the new drivers on seats, I hope they will do the big overhaul, review all aspects, incl. cutting down the dead wood as necessary and many other things. But results will take some time even though all the corrective measures are rightly taken. I foresee China will further lose the Uber Cup next year, but regain the Thomas Cup. One thing is also obvious, competition is getting keener, only drastic measures plus constant hard works may keep them ahead!

In near future, a good rebound in coming WC will serve as a good sign of still being at the highest level though I will expect none in WS dept.


Now switching eyes to the WTTC, a much bigger event with much broader coverage, about 608 players plus 200+ match officials. Here's a good video about the arena, a very high quality venue:
 
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Also, a big issue for China is how to use Zhang Nan properly. As we saw, Zhang Nan and Fu HF would imo beat any pair in the recent Sudirman Cup, such was the rich form and shape of the two. But now that FHF is retired, i believe restoring Zhang Nan with Liu Cheng is pointless. Zhang Nan clearly doesn't trust his defensive abilities and nor his mental strength on the big points.

Is there anyone who can compliment Zhang Nan as well as Fu HF?

Is Li Yunhui the most suitable XD partner?

There are few good years left of Zhang Nan's prime and Zhang Jun should look how to score maximum points with him.
 
kelana said:
Now switching eyes to the WTTC, a much bigger event with much broader coverage, about 608 players plus 200+ match officials. Here's a good video about the arena, a very high quality venue:
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In India, Table Tennis is not broadcasted at all. That's how big Table tennis is. Imagine 1.33 billion people unaware of who the table tennis stars are.
 
Nine Tailed Fox said:
Also, a big issue for China is how to use Zhang Nan properly. As we saw, Zhang Nan and Fu HF would imo beat any pair in the recent Sudirman Cup, such was the rich form and shape of the two. But now that FHF is retired, i believe restoring Zhang Nan with Liu Cheng is pointless. Zhang Nan clearly doesn't trust his defensive abilities and nor his mental strength on the big points.

Is there anyone who can compliment Zhang Nan as well as Fu HF?

Is Li Yunhui the most suitable XD partner?

There are few good years left of Zhang Nan's prime and Zhang Jun should look how to score maximum points with him.
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Yes, Zhang Nan is a rare gem in doubles, both XD and MD, but apart from Fu Haifeng who makes a worthy partner of equal caliber in MD and Zhao Yunlei in WD, I'm afraid, at the moment, there are none in CBA to fill their shoes yet. A pity.

Talent, experience and maturity as well as mental toughness, all in one person, is hard to come by and it takes time and great effort to nurture even when you've found an unpolished gem. Meanwhile, Zhang Nan can only wait.
 
zhuangcorp said:
I see that the Chinese team lacks heart.

The Japan and Korea players seem to enjoy the game, love the competition. They enjoy every moment.
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There is no lack of hearts. The key here is the overwhelming burden of being the favorite.

Just look at the very last match, the Chinese pair is currently the top XD pair by any reasonable measurement while the Korean pair lost two matches in a row. It's fine to talk about skills and strategies but they are all out of the windows for the Chinese pair was they were simply paralyzed by the pressure and did not do what they are usually capable of.
 
RedShuttle said:
There is no lack of hearts. The key here is the overwhelming burden of being the favorite.

Just look at the very last match, the Chinese pair is currently the top XD pair by any reasonable measurement while the Korean pair lost two matches in a row. It's fine to talk about skills and strategies but they are all out of the windows for the Chinese pair was they were simply paralyzed by the pressure and did not do what they are usually capable of.
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That's why I posed the question to someone,had the order of play been MD, MS, then XD, followed by the remaining two in any order what might probably be the final outcome ?

I feel that all the CHN players and pairs who lost put up subpar performances, starting with He Bingjiao, followed by Chen Qingchen/Jia Yifan, and Lu Kai/Huang Yaqiong.

But, that's the way professional sports go, they have to learn to take it in stride. Hopefully, the CHN Team draws the right lessons from defeat and become more determined, persevering and strong-willed in moving forward to overcome themselves to attain greater successes henceforth.
 
Justin L said:
That's why I posed the question to someone,had the order of play been MD, MS, then XD, followed by the remaining two in any order what might probably be the final outcome ?

I feel that all the CHN players and pairs who lost put up subpar performances, starting with He Bingjiao, followed by Chen Qingchen/Jia Yifan, and Lu Kai/Huang Yaqiong.

But, that's the way professional sports go, they have to learn to take it in stride. Hopefully, the CHN Team draws the right lessons from defeat and become more determined, persevering and strong-willed in moving forward to overcome themselves to attain greater successes henceforth.
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I think HBJ is good example of having heart but not the performance level. Contrasting to her heartless performance in one of the earlier tournaments, HBJ really put in heart and soul for this one. But it was just not enough.

CQC/JYF were simple too tired. It was made worse by their overly exuberant celebrations in the the first game. They tailed off even towards the end the first game and got nothing left for the second game. For them, I think the trouble started when the coaches put ZSW/CQC in the semi-final. It's all hypothetical now but I think if LK/HYQ was put in the semi-final, they would have kept their edge for the final and also save CQC the energy for a better performance in the final.

Obviously, this is not meant to diminish the accomplishment of the Koreans. They did it and really earned the Cup.
 
RedShuttle said:
I think HBJ is good example of having heart but not thae performance level. Contrasting to her heartless performance in one of the earlier tournaments, HBJ really put in heart and soul for this one. But it was just not enough.

CQC/JYF were simple too tired. It was made worse by their overly exuberant celebrations in the the first game. They tailed off even towards the end the first game and got nothing left for the second game. For them, I think the trouble started when the coaches put ZSW/CQC in the semi-final. It's all hypothetical now but I think if LK/HYQ was put in the semi-final, they would have kept their edge for the final and also save CQC the energy for a better performance in the final.

Obviously, this is not meant to diminish the accomplishment of the Koreans. They did it and really earned the Cup.
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I can't accept the tired concept. Have you heard Chen/JYF pair's interview after Semifinal?

Coaches did not consider them in their mind to play for Semifinal, but the opposite. This pair requested the coaches to give them chance (They prepared well even before asking the coaches). They proved it. I don't have any information about the finals.

Regarding HBJ, i don't have anything to say. Her game is over. The opponents have studied her completely. It is unlikely for her to win titles again. But Chen yufei will. It will take time.
 
Baddyforall said:
I can't accept the tired concept. Have you heard Chen/JYF pair's interview after Semifinal?

Coaches did not consider them in their mind to play for Semifinal, but the opposite. This pair requested the coaches to give them chance (They prepared well even before asking the coaches). They proved it. I don't have any information about the finals.

Regarding HBJ, i don't have anything to say. Her game is over. The opponents have studied her completely. It is unlikely for her to win titles again. But Chen yufei will. It will take time.
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Too early to write off He Bingjiao, premature. She is young and still evolving as a player. Atm, it's her fitness issue that lets her down, mostly. Once that's resolved, she'll be able to play to her capacity and develop further from there. Let's see.
 
I agree with Baddyforall here.

HBEjao has undergone Special Winter training, Special Sudirman Cup training and all that special training didn't have a tiny effect on her weight. Maybe she is genetically healthy.



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Remember @Justin L . not everyone can have eight pack crushed abs like Tai Tzu Ying.
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bayanbaru said:
Sun Yu, He BingJiao & Chen Qingchen a let down in Sudirman cup
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Justin L said:
I feel that all the CHN players and pairs who lost put up subpar performances, starting with He Bingjiao, followed by Chen Qingchen/Jia Yifan, and Lu Kai/Huang Yaqiong.
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Who of these were around in last Uber/Thomas and Sudirman Cup?

I agree a letdown for team. What is the root cause? Quite likely the succession policy in the Chinese which has created a gap in the middle ranks between the senior players and junior players. Bao Yixin and Tang Jinhua were used too sparingly. The gap in depth in ladies singles is well documented. He BJ would normally be a junior member or the team watching as a reserve player, playing the odd match. But because of China's messed up succession policy, the China team has had to field inexperienced juniors with some difficult decision making. Then, the team selectors were quite possibly under pressure to 'give the juniors ' more chances at getting experience. Team selectors probably also thought a SC win was safe with mens doubles and singles as sure bet wins in the final. The chips just didn't fall correctly for the Chinese team.

In team events like this, you need your most reliable players playing 1,3,4th matches or 2,3,4th matches. But that is more difficult in SC where a doubles player might play in two events and 'change' the order of play.
 
Cheung said:
Who of these were around in last Uber/Thomas and Sudirman Cup?

I agree a letdown for team. What is the root cause? Quite likely the succession policy in the Chinese which has created a gap in the middle ranks between the senior players and junior players. Bao Yixin and Tang Jinhua were used too sparingly. The gap in depth in ladies singles is well documented. He BJ would normally be a junior member or the team watching as a reserve player, playing the odd match. But because of China's messed up succession policy, the China team has had to field inexperienced juniors with some difficult decision making. Then, the team selectors were quite possibly under pressure to 'give the juniors ' more chances at getting experience. Team selectors probably also thought a SC win was safe with mens doubles and singles as sure bet wins in the final. The chips just didn't fall correctly for the Chinese team.

In team events like this, you need your most reliable players playing 1,3,4th matches or 2,3,4th matches. But that is more difficult in SC where a doubles player might play in two events and 'change' the order of play.
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I think, iirc, only Sun Yu was in the last Uber and/or Sudirman Cup but playing a secondary role, only played one match or so in the group stage.
 
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