Help with Stroke Please!!

Cheung said:
Are you referring to your right elbow? If so yes.

Don’t underestimate the role of the left arm mechanics which is what I wrote about.
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Yes I was referring to my right elbow. And although I see that my left arm plays a large role, it seems like the issue that everyone is calling me out on is my right arm. I think for me it would be too hard to work on my the right elbow and the left arm at the same time . But maybe I can! Or maybe by me driving with my right elbow it will fix some of the left arm issue
 
Ballschubser said:
Great progress over the years.

Never a friend of pointless smashing, but on the other hand I love to play singles where smashing is more of a tactical instrument compared to the almost bruteforce approach in doubles. But check your rally at 2:50 for example. You jump smash several times from the middle and you are not able to penetrate their defense (even finally losing the rally). The reason is quite simple, you just smash without purpose,a hard smash is not the goal, a good aimed smash is. You smash directly infront of the opponents, who don't have any issues to lift them.
So, try to either aim for the sides or middle, so that they have to move or atleast turn their bodies or take a step, or , if you target the body, aim higher. If you try to generate a steep smash, you should avoid to play directly infront of the opponent, just 1m to the left or right will have a much greater impact on your smash performance.
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I completely agree here ! In the rare cases that I intentionally aim my shots away from the opponents we normally win those rallies
 
SnowWhite said:
Considering that you have developed an effective shot with a panhandle, it is going to be very difficult to get rid of it. The racket face angle will be different, which will result in a loss of control, power, and it will simply feel like an unnatural shot. Your entire subconscious will try to get you to revert back to the panhandle, because it feels better. Even if you make some progress in a practicing session, when you play a game, your subconscious will prefer to play the more effective shot, and it will undo the progress.

Every coach I've ever met thinks learning the right technique from scratch is easier than having to unlearn and relearn it. However, I think that with the other aspects of the hitting technique that you already possess, like footwork and body rotation, it might all fall into place if you get the grip right.

I've never experienced it myself so I can't speak from experience, but I know an old coach that would tape the racket to the player's hand in the right grip and would have them play endless overhead shots. This would force their bodies and minds to learn the new movement without slipping back into the bad habit. The only alternative that would come close to this is for a coach to stand next to the court, only look at your grip and immediately tell you every time it slips. Also, don't focus on where the shuttle goes. Don't focus on the result, because at the start you will be able to get a better result with a worse technique. Instead focus on how it feels.

I remember when learning overhead hitting technique with the correct grip I was constantly hitting it to the left without trying to. So while it's not a good thing, at least if that's happening to you, you'll know you have the correct grip. Of course you can hit shots with the correct grip without that happening, so it's not a necessity, but it is what I experienced.
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This is good stuff
So I feel like I’m practice I am able to this correctly. How does this look ?
 
Mason said:
This is good stuff
So I feel like I’m practice I am able to this correctly. How does this look ?
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The racket is still not rotated to the correct grip. Compare how you hold the racket with online guides, and compare the angle of your racket face in preparation of your shot with the angle of the racket face of the pros, or online guides in preparation of their shot. You will quickly recognize the difference, and it will help you analyze your own footage better.

But don't try to emulate the racket angle. It is simply the result of using the correct grip. So, if you play with the correct grip, it will automatically change the angle. It is simply an easier way to spot if you use the correct grip without looking at your hand. Focus on using the correct grip, and look in your recordings at the racket face angle as a feedback mechanism.

I'm not a coach. I'm just a player that knows from being taught by coaches. So I'm reluctant to give more in depth advice, but I don't think it is needed. Just know what the correct grip is, and make yourself use it, one way or the other. Everything else should fall into place.
 
SnowWhite said:
The racket is still not rotated to the correct grip. Compare how you hold the racket with online guides, and compare the angle of your racket face in preparation of your shot with the angle of the racket face of the pros, or online guides in preparation of their shot. You will quickly recognize the difference, and it will help you analyze your own footage better.

But don't try to emulate the racket angle. It is simply the result of using the correct grip. So, if you play with the correct grip, it will automatically change the angle. It is simply an easier way to spot if you use the correct grip without looking at your hand. Focus on using the correct grip, and look in your recordings at the racket face angle as a feedback mechanism.

I'm not a coach. I'm just a player that knows from being taught by coaches. So I'm reluctant to give more in depth advice, but I don't think it is needed. Just know what the correct grip is, and make yourself use it, one way or the other. Everything else should fall into place.
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Ok I can see that my grip is rotated towards panhandle now ….I just thought that slight rotation towards panhandle is normal
 
Mason said:
Ok I can see that my grip is rotated towards panhandle now ….I just thought that slight rotation towards panhandle is normal
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Perhaps you can try starting the stroke non panhandle and as the racquet face hits the shuttle, it ends up slightly panhandle. You need to use your fingers to do this.

From your latest video, you have a lot of the basic technique. However, there the fine tuning with the grip that’s needed and better use of finger technique
 
Cheung said:
Perhaps you can try starting the stroke non panhandle and as the racquet face hits the shuttle, it ends up slightly panhandle. You need to use your fingers to do this.

From your latest video, you have a lot of the basic technique. However, there the fine tuning with the grip that’s needed and better use of finger technique
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So my grip should change and should end more panhandle after I strike the shuttle ?
 
Mason said:
So my grip should change and should end more panhandle after I strike the shuttle ?
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Aim to end the stroke only slightly panhandle. The main thing is use the fingers to achieve this and also tighten the fingers at point of striking the shuttle.

You should aim to generate power using the fingers without such a big body and upper arm movement.
 
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Cheung said:
Aim to end the stroke only slightly panhandle. The main thing is use the fingers to achieve this and also tighten the fingers at point of striking the shuttle.

You should aim to generate power using the fingers without such a big body and upper arm movement.
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Ok that makes sense
 
We want to see your hand taped to the racket handle in neutral grip!

Sent from my SM-G988W using Tapatalk
 
There are two strokes at 2.16 and 2.18. Slow it down to 0.25x

2.16 is good. Good pronation just before you hit the shuttle.

2.18 you open up the racquet face too early. You were doing a power shot.


The others I found it hard to see. Try filming in 50/60fps directly from the back of the court.
 
Cheung said:
There are two strokes at 2.16 and 2.18. Slow it down to 0.25x

2.16 is good. Good pronation just before you hit the shuttle.

2.18 you open up the racquet face too early. You were doing a power shot.


The others I found it hard to see. Try filming in 50/60fps directly from the back of the court.
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Ok thank you. This is very helpful to me because I definitely see the difference here between these two shots. I see that I open up the racket earlier on the 2:18 shot.

So for the 2:16 stroke , I definitely wasn’t trying to swing correctly I just was hitting around.like I wasn’t thinking “ ok in need to pronate”…. So i need to figure out why I was able to make that stroke the correct way at the 2:16 mark and then try to copy that again and again
 
Cheung said:
There are two strokes at 2.16 and 2.18. Slow it down to 0.25x

2.16 is good. Good pronation just before you hit the shuttle.

2.18 you open up the racquet face too early. You were doing a power shot.


The others I found it hard to see. Try filming in 50/60fps directly from the back of the court.
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Ok I can film from behind the court and all my videos are 60lbs

I think on almost all of my overhead shots I am hitting tje shuttle slightly too late , am I correct I’m that assumption ?
 
Cheung said:
I never tried this as a training aid. Do you just tape it for a few sessions? What are the drawbacks?
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You would tape it for training sessions and only hit forehand shots the entire time, with the vast majority being overhead shots, clears drops smashes, only playing frontcourt forehand shots to pull the player forward to practice backwards footwork in combination with using the correct grip. You would have the player do this until the overhead shots are natural to the player, sometimes for multiple sessions and they keep the correct grip without the tape. Preferably without any other non-taped training sessions or club nights in between.

It's pretty unusual and extreme, but extreme measures are necessary to kill the bad habits.

Maybe I'm a pessimist, but when I see a player playing with a panhandle, whether it's a full or even a half panhandle grip, I tend to have no hope whatsoever that they will ever correct it. Grip is learnt before everything else, whether consciously or not, so everything is entwined with grip. If grip is wrong, it takes an almost insurmountable effort of the player and coach to correct it, since every part of what they've learned is trying to keep the wrong grip. Hence why taping it in the right grip is a way to break free from those subconscious habits by making it physically impossible to revert to the wrong grip.

The main drawback is that you can't switch to different grips during the session, but if grip isn't right, correcting it is usually the highest priority. It can also be a bit of a blow to the ego. Having to accept that your own mind/body doesn't listen to you, and that external measures are necessary. Definitely a funny sight in the sports hall, so it takes some personal/social courage to implement it. The device @Mason posted could be a less conspicuous compromise, but I would be a bit worried that it allows the player to simply use the wrong grip over it anyway, or force the device to rotate over the handle.
 
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