Day 5: FINAL - China vs Indonesia
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badplayer2004
Regular Member
aiyuuw said:agree ningtyas, if there is one thing that fransisca has and not every other player has that would be her determination and fighting spirit, that girl got my respect for fighting hard till the end
in other words....she got heart
but still a long way to take out the chinese girls
badplayer2004
Regular Member
its unfortunate...lindan's playing style makes lots of people look down upon him despite being a deserving of world's no. 1
badplayer2004
Regular Member
indo disappointment was XD guy and taufik played below their par...opening the gate for the chinese sweep..
same thing with dane XD....nobody expected them to play that badly
dont think people are surprised peter lost to taufik
same with korean XD....nobody expected them to play that badly
its the playing badly(sub par) by everybody/ opponents that really helped ther chinese got the cup
same thing with dane XD....nobody expected them to play that badly
dont think people are surprised peter lost to taufik
same with korean XD....nobody expected them to play that badly
its the playing badly(sub par) by everybody/ opponents that really helped ther chinese got the cup
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badplayer2004
Regular Member
hcyong said:
yes..that was a great play...zhang and gao was SMASHING at nat alternately and she defended well..then they smash toward nova and he got surprised....he even let go of his racket trying to chase it.....
maybe he became part of the audience simply because na was doing so great that she awed everyone...including her partner right at the court...yes..blame his poor performance on her....
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badplayer2004 said:yes..that was a great play...zhang and gao was SMASHING at nat alternately and she defended well..then they smash toward nova and he got surprised....he even let go of his racket trying to chase it.....
maybe he became part of the audience simply because na was doing so great that she awed everyone...including her partner right at the court...yes..blame his poor performance on her....
lol,
lilyana was amazing, I wish it's she who met Zhang Ning...
badplayer2004 said:
i dont think taufik played badly. In the first game, taufik shoulda win but he is a slow starter, behind 0-4 before his engine oil is warm up. It work for shon (KOR) in the olympic but LD isn't shon. He was ahead 14-12 at one point. In the 2nd game, taufik kinda lost the desire. When INA lost the XD, beating LD would make no difference for INA. The first MS game had show me taufik has the talent to challenge LD.
cooler said:
Yeah, it was a really close game, when I saw Taufik was leading 14-12 in the first
set, I thought Lin Dan was going to lose that set for sure, but Lin Dan clawed his
way back and won that set -- unbelievable.
Honestly, before the match, I doubt anyone really believed Lin Dan would be able
to beat Taufik, I'm sure Lin Dan really wanted to, but I think he wasn't sure
himself. That's probably why he showed so much emotion after the win.
newplayer
ctjcad
Regular Member
I'll say LinDan's playing style is suited playing against a player like Taufik..The thing(s) LinDan has which I seemed to notice also is, he is quite diligent and hard-working, eventhough his techniques and "playing style" is not "as good" or some would say as "conventional" as say Taufik..Add those components with his speed and quickness and no wonder he is still the current #1..
I would say he is like the Sony Kuncoro of China, except with a bit more speed, quickness and power..
I would say he is like the Sony Kuncoro of China, except with a bit more speed, quickness and power..
badplayer2004 said:its unfortunate...lindan's playing style makes lots of people look down upon him despite being a deserving of world's no. 1
newplayer said:
i re-watched the match today.
yes. i too thought 1st game was over but Lin Dan managed to stay calm and got the game back.
after the 1st game, Taufik was 2 stops slower than the 1st. and near the end of the 2nd game, Taufik was noticably exhausted, his footwork was slow, he didn't try to do those fast back-up -> jumpsmash that he used in 1st game and use effectively against Gade throughout that game. his smashes are weaker and he wasn't able to unleash his big smashes like he did in game 1. and often when he was able to, he hit them out.
Lin Dan was still very energetic and later on in 2nd game, he definitely noticed Taufik's condition and just kept on making Taufik run and fooled around with him. it was obvious at that point that the match was over. there was no coming back for Taufik.
ctjcad
Regular Member
IMO, Nova blew it for Indo and Taufik disappointed at least me, if not his teammates/coaches and fans.. 
For the Danes XD, I thought they shouldn't replace Kamiila R. Juhl partner for Jens Eriksen..They should've stayed with whoever Kamilla's partner was, esp. the one that played quite well but lost in the recent AE XD Final against Robertson/Emms , I believe it was Thomas Laybourn..There's no time to switch partner(s) around, but maybe JE and Kamilla Juhl have played together before.
I think Taufik was quite surprised he won quite easily against Peter..Esp. after battling with him for 3 sets in the recent Japan Open..
Well, the new Korean XD hasn't play enough games together, esp. in big tournaments...They've been up and down, a win here and there, but i think the more they play, the more they'll get experience..
For the Danes XD, I thought they shouldn't replace Kamiila R. Juhl partner for Jens Eriksen..They should've stayed with whoever Kamilla's partner was, esp. the one that played quite well but lost in the recent AE XD Final against Robertson/Emms , I believe it was Thomas Laybourn..There's no time to switch partner(s) around, but maybe JE and Kamilla Juhl have played together before.
I think Taufik was quite surprised he won quite easily against Peter..Esp. after battling with him for 3 sets in the recent Japan Open..
Well, the new Korean XD hasn't play enough games together, esp. in big tournaments...They've been up and down, a win here and there, but i think the more they play, the more they'll get experience..
badplayer2004 said:
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ctjcad
Regular Member
Hmm, Taufik won against LinDan @ the recent Indonesian Open(3 sets), so at least that showed a sign that he is capable of playing/challenging LinDan..Again, if I have a chance, I would like to watch that match and compare it with the SC Finals match..
cooler said:
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ctjcad
Regular Member
It's all psychological and in the mind..
I wasn't really surprise LinDan won. I mean the way I look at it before the match was it's even, 50-50..I thought the decider would be tie #1, which happened to be XD..If the Indos had won the XD, Taufik will have an edge over LinDan(psychologically)..But it wasn't their day and for sure not Taufik's..Thus when the Indos XD lost, the momentum changed and LinDan gained the edge(psychologically)...That's why we all see LinDan was able to absorb the game pt in the set set and able to make a deuce and go on to take the 1st set..Simple as that, LinDan was simply the "looser and more relaxed" player..I'm sure if the Indos XD had won, Taufik would most likely close out the 1st set..But it wasn't the case..
IMO, both players are about even par..It's a matter of psychological advantage, who has the more pressure to play, who's "looser" at the time of the match, and who wants it more, that's the determining factor(s) between these 2 heavy-weight MS giants..
I wasn't really surprise LinDan won. I mean the way I look at it before the match was it's even, 50-50..I thought the decider would be tie #1, which happened to be XD..If the Indos had won the XD, Taufik will have an edge over LinDan(psychologically)..But it wasn't their day and for sure not Taufik's..Thus when the Indos XD lost, the momentum changed and LinDan gained the edge(psychologically)...That's why we all see LinDan was able to absorb the game pt in the set set and able to make a deuce and go on to take the 1st set..Simple as that, LinDan was simply the "looser and more relaxed" player..I'm sure if the Indos XD had won, Taufik would most likely close out the 1st set..But it wasn't the case..
IMO, both players are about even par..It's a matter of psychological advantage, who has the more pressure to play, who's "looser" at the time of the match, and who wants it more, that's the determining factor(s) between these 2 heavy-weight MS giants..
newplayer said:
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Brave_Turtle
Regular Member
Indo coach should really find another partner for Natsir in MX because Widianto is just not her level. Kinda waste of talent here.
Any of Sigit, Candra, Luluk, Alven would be a better choice. I was very impressed how Natsir played troughout the whole SC. Tight at net, nice movement, nice shot placement, good defense.
Nova Widianto was just not there, in fact he was weaker than Natsir. Unlike other men in MX he couldn't put pressure on the other team girl.
I think for Taufik Vs Lin Dan, MX was a great decider. Taufik playing in china, lost 1st set which he could win and knowing that his MX team lost really put pressure on him.
I think it was a great match. Lin Dan won it fair and square. You could also see that Taufik and Lin Dan are about same skill because the match could really have gone the other way around. Taufik was so close...
For the the bad line call, I remember 2 or 3 calls that was very tight to the line. If you watch closely you can see that Taufik was against a line call but kept his cool and kept on playing. I do not know if those were in or out but it was really really really tight and I was suprised that they were only showing it 1 time in a very weird angle.
So, Lin Dan was a better man than Taufik that day. It's still 1-1 and we will have to wait till WC to have our rematch. But will they reach final?
Any of Sigit, Candra, Luluk, Alven would be a better choice. I was very impressed how Natsir played troughout the whole SC. Tight at net, nice movement, nice shot placement, good defense.
Nova Widianto was just not there, in fact he was weaker than Natsir. Unlike other men in MX he couldn't put pressure on the other team girl.
I think for Taufik Vs Lin Dan, MX was a great decider. Taufik playing in china, lost 1st set which he could win and knowing that his MX team lost really put pressure on him.
I think it was a great match. Lin Dan won it fair and square. You could also see that Taufik and Lin Dan are about same skill because the match could really have gone the other way around. Taufik was so close...
For the the bad line call, I remember 2 or 3 calls that was very tight to the line. If you watch closely you can see that Taufik was against a line call but kept his cool and kept on playing. I do not know if those were in or out but it was really really really tight and I was suprised that they were only showing it 1 time in a very weird angle.
So, Lin Dan was a better man than Taufik that day. It's still 1-1 and we will have to wait till WC to have our rematch. But will they reach final?
Brave_Turtle said:
When did these 2 or 3 bad calls happen? Can you list the score and who was
serving at the time? I watched the game at least 4 times and didn't see a single
bad call. All the close calls were replayed in closed-up slow motion on the big
screen. There was only 1 time that the linesman couldn't say whether the shuttle
was in or out, because Lin Dan's leg blocked the view when he was serving,
and that point was replayed and went to Taufik.
If you think all the linesmen were secretly helping Lin Dan, then what about the
match referee who was white? Do you think he didn't do a good job overrulling
the bad calls? Or do you think the Chinese bought him over with lots of money?
newplayer
nueva_symphony
Regular Member
cooler said:how do u define a 'great' player? does having fluid like movement a necessary requirement for a great player? Maybe his weakness is due to his strength - like why be good at net when LD can beat many players with his other core skills? why master something when one dont need it yet
Bruce Lee is undoubtedly a legendary fighter. He achieve that by cutting out the craps of the old style fluid-flowery moves of the traditional kungfu and replaced with SPEED AND EXPLOSIVENESS.
In golf: it's drive for show and putt for dough
My saying is:
In badminton and fighting: it's strokes for show and speed for dough.
Look at china's latest success, LD, Xia ZX, CH. What are their core skills?
Now if u go back and watch han jian vs morten frost 1985 MS final at calgary, big difference. Time changed. No way china going back to han jian styles. He'll be cut up if he plays loppies with LD LOL
Well, I would consider a player truly great if he/she can entertain spectators with aesthetically pleasing play and yet have the exceptional skills to win on a regular basis. This is a common trait of truly great players. In golf, Tiger Woods has an excellent swing that is also beautiful. Roger Federer plays beautiful tennis. Brazil plays extravagant and exciting soccer. Jan Ove Walder played wonderfully in table tennis to even be a threat to the Chinese at his peak. Sure, one can be great even without this artistry if one can win all the time. However, you would find it as a spectator absolutely boring. I think the loss of the artistic aspect in sport would be detrimental in terms of garnering support and funding.
Frankly, Lin Dan vs Taufik Hidayat matches are exciting not so much because Lin Dan is world number one, but because many want to see whether the artistic play of Hidayat's is still effective in this day and age against the most prolific winner. I don't know how many people would be enthused to see a Lin Dan vs Chen Hong final over and over again. I believe some would prefer to see Zhang Ning play against Xie Xingfang.
Bruce Lee indeed cut out a lot of fluid crap, but by no means was his own art of self defence not fluid. In fact, he often used water as an analogy to teach people on how to channel energy. You can't get more fluid than that. Beautiful and effective, not beautiful and crap!!!
Brave_Turtle
Regular Member
seven said:I think we shouldn't judge and "burry" Nova Widianto after just one match (this final), as everyone agreed he didn't play well in this match.
Nova Widianto is a great MX player and has done wonders before (including SF against Denmark) so don't be too harsh with him!
Sorry Seven if I sounded harsh, I didnt really meant to. I didn't base it on only 1 match. But even in SF he didn't play too well.
Its just unfortunate because Natsir is such a wonder to me. She just need a better partner
Brave_Turtle said:
Well, if they thrashed Eriksen/Juhl this way (15-7 15-4!!!) without him playing well, what would have happened if he had played well?!?
He truely is a great player in that case!
This being said, maybe Lilyana Natsir could find a better MX partner, but I doubt one of the MD players you cited would be better than Widianto.
Maybe Flandy Limpele would be a good choice as some mentionned?